VA investigators find entire claims and other critical documents in shredding bins at Detroit Regional Office. VA official will only say, "I can't talk about that."

http://www.vawatchdog.org/08/nf08/nfoct08/nf101308-1.htm

All of us trusting individuals can have a cup of this coffee. I know some folks frown upon negatisim but this really hammers home the points some of us have made over the years.

They need to fire them all and start over.

I think this is the tip of the iceburg.

J

Another VA issue that doesn't shock me...

I have an idea....everyone who reads this should forward it to their local news media whether it be TV or newspaper. The VA really doesn't like negative media coverage and it will help to get the word out to the general public; otherwise no one other than vets will ever know about this.

I agree J because they have lost all creditably at this point..I think it would be very gullible to believe it was a few bad apples. I think it is more ramped than we all think.....I my self can not find a whole mental Health file gone and I have wrote and called everyone and it is as if it never existed. I have documents in my C-file that pertain to treatment I had completed through MH clinic and made reference to my treatment in my claim but it is still as if it never existed, even no empty jacket nothing, zip, zilch.......

It's in every layer of our government.
I wonder if they will catch the actual F**Kups that did this
AND THE HIGHER UP'S THAT GAVE DIRECTIONS to do it.
My bet is Bay Pines Florida is doing just as much illegal crap
and I wouldn't doubt BVA too, they certainly are not immune.
And they wonder why veterans and VA Claimants get attitudes.
HA HA HA HA HA - B-turds!
carlie

I guess they shredded my award letter since it has been 10 weeks and I have not received my back pay!

I think they forgot a few other places such as NY NY, Newark New Jersey, Atlanta Georgia. and etc.!!!

The more they look, the more they will find...I have little doubt this has been going on for several years.

They should have to save everything or put it on microfilm. As a legal custodian I must save everthing in case they ever have questions on my brothers finances.

Lori:

Welcome to Hadit.

Wow even more important to review your "C" File in my opinion. They should put anyone at VA in jail that destroys original documents.

I think we all know this was more than 10 documents or just a "handful" this is widespread and the complete damage done will never be known and it is not just destruction of papers it is the lives that have been destroyed by the claim not being handled timely, cars that have repossessed, homes in bankruptcy, divorces because of financial troubles etc, the lives that have been destroyed it's not just a few papers that have been shredded

Just think about it, Our prisons are full of people who have done less criminal activity.

J

Sad part of it is they are saying that they are doing this in the name of the Veterans Privacy.

Our top Senator, of Veterans Affairs, says that it is only because there is not enough room for the VA to store the records. This is an excuse that says the shredding is OK, because there is no room for the records.

It seems that with the VAs supposed interest in electronic record-keeping that they would simply scan all of these documents into their system and immediately return them.

Oh wait.....OMGosh.....somebody might have to work at the VAROs..........nevermind.

There are plenty of solutions it's just too bad the VA won't hear any of them.

ST. Petersburg lost my evidence and claims so often I got to the point that I would only hand deliver stuff to them. They scare me. I have gotten denials from them that contained so many errors and were so dumb I could hardly believe it. My and my psychologist can't make heads or tails of some of their decisions. They are just not logical.

I at one time thought this would be ideal. Scanning medical records into a data base for providers that give me or my family care. No Not Ever my thoughts. Okay I know my info is all over the place even with Hippa. My reason three different doctors in less than a 24 hours told me that's most dangerous. Va and civilian Drs.alike. Each said don't support it.

Seeing near all the Drs. only keep what I consider 'tight' notes, meds, straightforward diagnosis and tests ordered. Docs said they would never have thier personal medical records online due to safety.

We are vulnerable I feel , with Ssa, Va, Dmv, Insurance and IRs not to mention white pages reverse # lookup & satellite imaging.

I see minimal release of information key to everyones safety. No paper checks or regular mail sounds extreme? My bank is starting to charge for paper 2009.

Shredding is a fact and I tell everyone military related Copy Medical records and again later same year. Then keep them safe.

My rant, my heartbreak for vets claims shredded.

Cg

Waco. That's me. Definately time to check the C-file.

House Committee on Veterans' Affairs
335 Cannon House Office Building
Washington, D.C. 20515
or fax your letter to: (202) 225-2034
or call: (202) 225-9756


Call, email or write to your Congressional representatives and join countless veterans who have already called the Committee on Veterans Affairs, demanding a hearing on this latest fiasco-

A few VA employees have posted at VA Watchdog their knowledge of this situation-not just in the 4 VAROs named but all over the country.

Since Directors of every VARO had to make a report to DC this AM- after spending the weekend looking for any missing mail or claims-
maybe a lot of missing stuff turned up.

Veterans and widows -per many vets sites- are taking action on this and writing,calling, and emailing their congressional reps as well as the Committee H VAC and S VAC-

As Larry Scott said there is more to come and we arent going to like it.

I have to add taking the worse VARO's in the US I'd have to say these one we are hearing about are the only ones that got caught and they were doing it with such ease they just got plain sloppy. What scares me the most is I had documents that would have proved my claim with out a doubt concerning my medical issues and I was treated in combat zone and at home while in service and all there is left of my Mental Health jacket at all is just exams from where I entered service all other documentation is gone. Documentation of in service treatment does not now exist at all now I have to assume for my self that they have been shredded as well and now I have to go the long way around to prove a claim. As I said thee are the ones that got caught and I believe the VA would have you think its only these couple of offices and a few bad apples, after what I have been through and seen here on this board and read over the last 3 years they will never convence me of that.........

recently my medical records showing my hospital stay in the navy were located after twenty years of denials. Va says to me if you were sick how come you didn't get medical help at the VA?

I replied well from 79 to 1995 or 98 i was told and turned away from the va medical plan because you have to be service connected thats why. VA says oh.

According to NPRC the VA charged out my medical records back in 1982 and had those missing records in their possession all the time.

Never i'm sorry. Never what can we do to make it right.


Now I'm going to pass on to you an article from the New York Times in regard to the recent mess in Texas and other points dealing with shredding. Ya Hooray the New York Times, yes the New York Times.


ARTICLE TITLED : VETERANS AGENCY FINED FOR DESTROYING DATA



BY ROBERT LINDSAY SPECIAL TO THE NEW YORK TIMES JANUARY 9, 1987


LEAD: RULING THE VETERANS ADMINISTRATION HAD UN LAWFULLY AND RECKLESSLY DESTROYED THOUSANDS OF DOCUMENTS A FEDERAL JUDGE TODAY IMPOSED $ 115,000 IN PENALTIES AGAINST THE VA

THE AGENCY HAD BEEN ORDERED TO PRODUCE THE DOCUMENTS IN A LAWSUIT BY VETERANS CHARGING THAT THEY WERE EXPOSED TO RADIATION.


WAS SENT TO ME BY VIETNAM VET FROM

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9BODE7D6153CF93AA357


Hum? 1987 and now it's 2008 and now veterans keep getting denials.


remember the record back in the 60s their coming to take away ha ha
their coming to take me away ho ho he he ha ha to the funny farm where life is beautiful all the time
their coming to take me away ha ha their coming to take me away

VA to be fined? hum? how does this work? deduct away our tax dollars used to fund them to help veteran? or does this mean they will be a little light of those x-mas bonuses or the veterans suffer worse than ever? How does this work exactly compared to jail time? This makes me sick at my stomach I mean really sick.....

well what they will do is give all veterans employees a raise for saving them a LOT
of money , then they will take the tax money used to fund the operation and get some of it probably a lot so they can move it to another program and they can say we cannot hire any more people because we dont have the money. and naturally this
will double your claim time. why didnt they think of this before?

Grent welcome to Hadit. I was discharged in 1970 and first time in a VA was 1991 and after that I have 3 letters from VA saying I was not eligible.

In reality, As a former Va employee who actually dealt with that area, The awards are budgeted and each department splits up the money and the employees get a share.

J

Why would employee's get a share of money budgeted for Veterans? Wouldn't that be an incentive to low ball Veterans?

yup that's how it work according to a link i read here. There (VARO)are allocated money for claims and whats left over they get new computers, chair, and slice the pie for bonuses... That's why my last comment post here how come they don't fire everyone and where is the money coming from for the fines? They have lost all creditability at those VARO's and they are just the ones that got caught. I always thought these kinda things happen here and there and sometimes but it sound more like it running rampid if they can't deny you out right they shred what does connect you and that scares the crap out of me.....................

Shreddergate as it is now being called brings to my mind not only the shredding of documents, but the shredding of our lives. By the time folks reach HadIt.com they usually have been in the VA system for sometime and i believe they know what i mean, your dignity has been shredded, your emotional health and perhaps even your relationships, shredded also, it is no wonder they have taken to shredding our documents, they may be bits of paper to them, but to us they are lives, lives possibly in an almost unbearable limbo. they are our lives and the lives of our brothers and sisters.

TAKE ACTION
http://www.hadit.com/contact_congress_and_media.html

VA claims found in piles to be shredded
http://www.armytimes.com/news/2008/10/mili...edding_101608w/

Shreddergate as it is now being called brings to my mind not only the shredding of documents, but the shredding of our lives. By the time folks reach HadIt.com they usually have been in the VA system for sometime and i believe they know what i mean, your dignity has been shredded, your emotional health and perhaps even your relationships, shredded also, it is no wonder they have taken to shredding our documents, they may be bits of paper to them, but to us they are lives, lives possibly in an almost unbearable limbo. they are our lives and the lives of our brothers and sisters.

TAKE ACTION
http://www.hadit.com/contact_congress_and_media.html

VA claims found in piles to be shredded
http://www.armytimes.com/news/2008/10/mili...edding_101608w/

Tbird this is a very good analogy, the shredding just don't stop at the shredder it reaches into our lives and continues its damage and the damage is so bad it is "Titanic" your claim sinks and you never make it to the other side and you are doomed to limbo and lie on the bottom...........

x
x
x


Going to play the devils advocate, and say that unless you were born in a foreign country, and spent less than 30 days in the military, you know that the GOV is a massive burocracy that LOVES it's paperwork. As a matter of fact, born and raised in the USA, you know that you are nothing but a Number to the GOV, from birth until death you sign and file paperwork til it's coming outta your ears! And, you know they are crooked: the banks lose your mortgage payment, the teacher loses your homework, the County loses your marriage liscence, etc etc.

You MUST keep personal copies of ALL documents and safegurad them!!!!

For many, and for too long, the veteran is NOT going to see justice served on his or her claim at the VARO level. The claim isn't going to see the light of day until it gets to the BVA or the Courts. So, keep it simple and hope for a quick DENIAL, so you can Appeal to the higher courts.

VARO Employees are mostly, totally ignorant of VA Laws and Regulations.

I would NOT waste my time ever talking to them on the phone about my Claim. Believe NOTHING the front desk tells you, they will say anything to get you off the phone. If you do make a call, the Front Desk at the VARO is AUTHORIZED by VA Regs, to suspennd your compensation for any statement that sounds like forfeture or fraud. Like, don't tell them I'm a happy camper, going fishing -- or worse, tell them to take their Compensation and stick it where the sun don't shine, 'cause they will! Your neighbors can call and complain, and VARO can take immediate action to reduce or suspend your award.

Everything in writing to the VA should be either Notorized or, at minimum, Certified Mail. You always need a witness to their bullshit. Don't go to C@P Exams alone, don't even go for health care alone if that's possible. Take a Buddy. Watch your back. Don't get hostile no matter if you gotta bite your tongue off.

One more vent, I have never advocated sending more than one Claim at a time. It's too EASY for the VARO to DUMP all your claims at the same time this way. If they are going to SHRED a claim, hope that it's only that ONE CLAIM, and not 4-5 claims on appeal. Whenever possible, your Letter Heading to the VARO should be Claim #1, next Letter is Claim #2. I know that's not always possible with intertwined claims, but if you can, take it one at a time. That's my advice for what it's worth.

I fought the AF Review Boards for 4-5 years, and my Honorable Discharge was sent to the VARO 5 years ago. I sent them a copy, the AF sent them a copy, and St Louis sent them a copy. Guess what, they told me to send them another copy.

OMG, it's enough to make you completely insane!

I pray to God for justice for all veterans.

~Wings

Thursday, October 23, 2008 -

ST. PETERSBURG (Bay News 9) -- Employees at the Department of Veteran's Affairs benefits office in St. Petersburg improperly shredded eight documents, investigators with the VA said.

According to Bay News 9's partner paper, the St. Petersburg Times, the VA investigators said seven of those documents would have been critical in making a decision about a veteran's claim. Officials said they do not know if the documents were dumped by accident or on purpose.

The VA is now extending a national ban on all shredding in its benefits offices, until the agency works out a policy to safeguard documents.

Inspectors said they found similar circumstances in three other cities.

http://www.baynews9.com/content/36/2008/10...operly+shredded

I won't paste the whole article, but you should read this!

http://www.tampabay.com/news/military/vete...ticle867002.ece

It says, VA documents improperly shredded

Nope, I'd have to say they did a pretty good job. shredding that is..

I would like to know how they know how many documents were shredded?