I don't do a lot of face to face with vets, these days. Years ago when the Vietnam vet wannabes and fakers, started to recount their days in the jungle. I would ask them one question: " So, what was your MOS?" A blank stare, or hesitation, usually gave them away.


I am also a bit disappointed how the word "HERO", is thrown around, these days. It devalues the word and the deeds. Just being incountry, does not make one a hero.

I watched a 60 min. episode of a man who went through life claiming he was a retired admiral, and got away with it too, for the most part. He wore a Congressional Medal Honor, the show played a clip of Pres. Bush saluting him!

After a serious of failed business ventures, or cons is a better word, I think He finally committed suicide.

Come to find out he was the son of an Admiral from the 'Ol man's first marriagem and was the black sheep of the family...I guess so!

With the Internet, helps verify claims, it makes it easier today to see if someone is lying.

You could have a NEC and have run through the jungle too.

Good point,

Boondoc




I am also a bit disappointed how the word "HERO", is thrown around, these days. It devalues the word and the deeds. Just being incountry, does not make one a hero.
[/quote]

Commander Bob,

You are absolutely right about the wanna be's. Like you I am very careful about folks who claim to be Vets. Especially Viet Nam Vets. I've had so many jerks come up to me and talk about being in secret units that "they'd have to kill me if they told me". However, they couldn't tell me where they took basic, what their MOS was or what unit they were assigned to in the Army.
I spent 20 plus years in combat boots either in Armor or Aviation, and I never saw a unit (other than Delta or the old Phoenix program) that was in black ops. Especially one that took civilians straight off the street and turn them into super duper ninji killing machines without benefit of any basic training and AIT.

I get so damn mad that I just want to grab them and kick their a**. Instead I usually expose these worthless creatures of dung for what they are and enjoy their dismay at being exposed as a fraud in front of a crowd. Heroes my a**. These pathetic, slimey, worthless POS do dishonor to our brothers and sisters who gave their lives for our country.

Excuse me--I just noticed that I am slobbering, my right eye is twitching, veins have protruding from my forehead and I have inadvertently chewed through my desk. Time to go take one of those little pills those nice people down at VA tell me to take for my anger management problem.

Cav

We have a wall in DC full of Heros, the true heros that fought for Freedom. The fakes know they are looking at a liar each time they look into the mirror. Just think we fought for those assholes also!

[quote name='Commander Bob 92-93' date='Aug 3 2009, 07:58 PM' post='158312']
I don't do a lot of face to face with vets, these days. Years ago when the Vietnam vet wannabes and fakers, started to recount their days in the jungle. I would ask them one question: " So, what was your MOS?" A blank stare, or hesitation, usually gave them away.


I am also a bit disappointed how the word "HERO", is thrown around, these days. It devalues the word and the deeds. Just being incountry, does not make one a hero.
[/quote]

You are right on about this one C-Bob about this Hero stuff it is used very loosely. I my self was in a non-combat MOS but have been there many times and was never afraid to say my MOS. I have seen a lot of those pauses your talking about too. Hero? Na I'm no "HERO" I just always felt we were fighting for each other than our country, but don't get me wrong I love my country make no mistake about it but I have always personally felt those left behind or those who risked them selves for the sake of many. Those who gave more then the rest of us or saved us from a bad way. Not all of us were "HEROES" we were just trying to keep each other alive..I am a pretty good judge of caricature and I still do as my daddy said listen 2 time more than you speak to people sort out the BS for your self. Yoggie

The fakes, wannabes, and the phonies don't know what a MOS is. Even if they have been hanging out with real vets, or watching war movies. The number and letter combinations in a MOS, trip them up, and usually they will talk about units, war stories, or areas of operations,instead. Recently, I had an opportunity to ask a young hero vet who was working on my car and telling me his war stories after he noticed my PH auto tag. After awhile, I asked him "what was your MOS?" He said Strikers Unit. You could tell he was clueless about what a MOS was. This method works 99% of the time.

I had a guy tell me that being an Army paratrooper was a part of SF, is this true?

BoonDoc

[quote name='Commander Bob 92-93' date='Aug 4 2009, 10:32 AM' post='158388']
The fakes, wannabes, and the phonies don't know what a MOS is. Even if they have been hanging out with real vets, or watching war movies. The number and letter combinations in a MOS, trip them up, and usually they will talk about units, war stories, or areas of operations,instead. Recently, I had an opportunity to ask a young hero vet who was working on my car and telling me his war stories after he noticed my PH auto tag. After awhile, I asked him "what was your MOS?" He said Strikers Unit. You could tell he was clueless about what a MOS was. This method works 99% of the time.
[/quote]

Where were all these heros back in the late 60's and early 70's when people were doing everything possible to stay out of Vietnam? There was not one person in my basic training company who volunteered for the infantry. They were all draftees as far as I know, and you should have seen the faces when they got their AIT assignments. It was considered a possible death sentence to get sent for advanced infantry training.

I was drafted and they sent me to radio repair school.

[quote name='Pete53' date='Aug 4 2009, 01:33 PM' post='158420']
I was drafted and they sent me to radio repair school.
[/quote]


Oh yeah??? What was your MOS?

You are our hero Pete53, here at Hadit.

[quote name='Cavtrooper088' date='Aug 3 2009, 09:06 PM' post='158325']
Commander Bob,

You are absolutely right about the wanna be's. Like you I am very careful about folks who claim to be Vets. Especially Viet Nam Vets. I've had so many jerks come up to me and talk about being in secret units that "they'd have to kill me if they told me". However, they couldn't tell me where they took basic, what their MOS was or what unit they were assigned to in the Army.
I spent 20 plus years in combat boots either in Armor or Aviation, and I never saw a unit (other than Delta or the old Phoenix program) that was in black ops. Especially one that took civilians straight off the street and turn them into super duper ninji killing machines without benefit of any basic training and AIT.

I get so damn mad that I just want to grab them and kick their a**. Instead I usually expose these worthless creatures of dung for what they are and enjoy their dismay at being exposed as a fraud in front of a crowd. Heroes my a**. These pathetic, slimey, worthless POS do dishonor to our brothers and sisters who gave their lives for our country.

Excuse me--I just noticed that I am slobbering, my right eye is twitching, veins have protruding from my forehead and I have inadvertently chewed through my desk. Time to go take one of those little pills those nice people down at VA tell me to take for my anger management problem.

Cav
[/quote]
Man it aint going to do you any good to get so upset that you stroke out over this issue.There are fakes out there and there will continue to be fakes when we are dead and gone.

I have seen some fakes even here.

Get your mind off of it. Your better off. Dont stroke out over it.

J

BoonDoc, try this link...


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_Forces_%28United_States_Army%29

I agree, jbasser.. I mentioned it, because Tbird raised the topic, the other day.

I blame it on the ignorance of my youth, John999. However I joined the Army ( RA ) in 1966, and told the recruiter that my choice of jobs was infantry. They granted my request... LOL

Didn't think so....thanks for the link.
BoonDoc

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_Forces_%28United_States_Army%29
[/quote]

If you want to look at some posers take a look at a lot of the guys in Rolling Thunder. How many Nam vets starch their jeans? Not many.

Bill

I guess the my words about Hero's bother some of you, I am firm in what I believe.
Answer some questions: Yes you need to be a paratrooper to be in Special Forces
I was a Drill Sergeant during 1968-1971, and 80% of Draftees went to Infantry Schools
The others went to wide range of MOSs
By the way my MOSs are 11B5P OOR OOE 11F3P

That is great way to catch the Fakers, I like to ask them the jump commands when they tell me they where Airborne

They come up with some great ones

[quote name='BoonDoc' date='Aug 4 2009, 02:11 PM' post='158435']
Didn't think so....thanks for the link.
BoonDoc

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_Forces_%28United_States_Army%29


[/quote]


You are right BoonDoc, being a paratrooper does not make one a member of Special Forces, however, like sgmdae just posted "yes you need to be a paratrooper to be in Special Forces. Thanks for the clarification Sarge. I was just an 11Bravo....with dreams of becoming a door gunner...

I just read many of your posts, sqmdae, and found nothing about heroes you posted that should bother anyone. I salute you and your service record.

Bob

I joined the Army in 1969. I think the attitude about the war had changed a great deal since 1966. By the time I got to RVN in 1970 I think the belief was that the war was not going to be won. We were in some kind of holding pattern until someone came up with an idea for us to sneak out of there without actually admitting it was a disaster. People were still dying especially in I Core. The USA could have pulled up stakes at that point and just left, but thousands more had to die. I know after I left it got worse with soldiers actually refusing to go out on patrol. They kept sending them to LBJ, but they they burned it down at one point. What can you do with soldiers who don't want to fight anymore? The army did not have the guts to shoot them. There would have been riots at home if that got out to the public.

Get ready,... Stand up,... Hook up,... Check static line,... Check equipment,...Sound off for equipment check.... Stand in the door,... Go....

[url="http://paratrooperprayers.tripod.com/id62.html"]http://paratrooperprayers.tripod.com/id62.html[/url]

[quote name='john999' date='Aug 4 2009, 02:56 PM' post='158443']

So true John,... The Summer of 68' changed everything. IMHO

[quote name='Commander Bob 92-93' date='Aug 4 2009, 03:10 PM' post='158434']
I blame it on the ignorance of my youth, however I joined the Army ( RA ) in 1966, and told the recruiter that my choice of jobs was infantry. They granted my request... LOL
[/quote]


LOL...I did worse than that...I enlisted for Airborne, unassigned. Wound up in the Infantry anyway (as I suspected).

Pat

Bob, Great job on the jump commands, I could add a few of the time table commands, what the heck you did good, Airborne all the way.
I spent a split tour, they were always setting LBJ on fire, but your right soldier started to refuse.
I had a split tour, two TET offenses, 68 and 69, last mission was Hamburger hill, at the end
When I di some research for Forgotten PTSD, did you know we had 64 Killed and over 400 wounded,
now I know why I blocked it, B Co took most of thekilled, I was on the Hill at the bottom, last group to go up collect equipment, wounded and some killed that not yet be extracted. What a muddy mess
Guess I am off the subject, Sorry my Brothers and Sisters

Although I was at FT. Benning for basic, I did not go back to jump school or OCS, as planned. I was sent to 05B20 school then to light Inf. AIT then Hawaii, then RVN. Never made it to jump school. I would love to jump out of a plane, however , my wife won't let me. Ha...

It is palced now at my #1 greatest experience in my life, exiting that aircraft, and being free with stillness and quite.

I use to say my #1 experience will killing for the Freedom of my country. I found through the years the PC and hurt people feeling. I working on being more calm, and not so agressive.

You survived A Shau Valley, Hill 937. You are truly a hero, in my book, sgmdae.

I was wounded just after Tet 68', outside of xxxxxxx, I corp. That ended my active duty and my career plans.

How does the Army get young HS graduates to enlist in the combat arms in this day and age? They can enlist in the Air Force and learn about computers or something. That is a lot better than climbing up moutains in Afghanistan with a pack on your back. Not a big demand for infantry troops back in the states after they get back to civilian life. I know that some people just like it and more power to them. Do the youngsters get large enlistment bonuses for going 11B?

Testosterone, and visions of glory, John999. Beside it's a hell of an adventure.

I remember the day, around 2 weeks into basic training, when I wondered if I had made a mistake with my career choice.

Bonus and education benefits are hugh
John, I got to tell you I was Recruiter, 1971-to end of the Draft, they was never a shortage of people wanted to Vietnam and combat arms. You hear all the stories, hell no, no one want to go
Not true in my in the trenches opinion

Commander Bob, thank you for comment, it was days work for a Army and Country that I love and still do.
I have kept a wall around me for 40 years, I am letting the wall down just a bit, and asking for some help.
Like a good soldier, when the wall comes down I place a brick up to make it stronger.
I jsu begun my VA career, not sure I will continue, I not getting any satisfaction out of it
I have learn to live with all my pass.
It Lonly and unemotional, I don't smile much
I don't let anyone get close, so I don't have anyone to share my happiness with, so what is the need

roger that, sgmdae... I have always tried to keep my back to that wall you are talking about. Life is short, even if we get 100 years or so. ( quote Tom Hanks, Movie, Cast Away )"We have to keep breathing. Besides, who knows what the tide will bring in".

[quote name='JustPLS' date='Aug 4 2009, 03:23 PM' post='158453']
LOL...I did worse than that...I enlisted for Airborne, unassigned. Wound up in the Infantry anyway (as I suspected).

Pat
[/quote]


We were young, then...


Bob

I just got back from National Night Out. There was a guy there that had on a full uniform, claiming that he was of all things a Buffalo Soldier. He was about 60 year old. I put his ass on full blast. The more the crowd gather the louder I got. He got his sorry ass in his car and left. The nerve of him.

Good job Sharon. You are my hero tonight. Thanks for kicking that puke's butt.

For those who may not know it the Buffalo soldiers made up the 9th inf regiment and the 10th Cavalry regiment, and there is a statue dedicated to these brave old soldiers at Ft. Leavenworth KS where it is viewed by every Command and General staff class that goes to Leavenworth.
The term Buffalo soldier was given to the soldiers of these regiments by the Plains Indians during the Indian wars of the late 1800's as a token of honor to their bravery. The ranks of both these regiments were made up entirely of black soldiers who fought for a country that more oft than not treated them as second class citizens.

I had the honor of serving as a Cav platoon leader in H troop 10th Cavalry RVN 72-73. Woooooah

Cav

I believe the gentleman would have to be in his 80's, to have served in the any of the Buffalo Soldier units of WWII.

Here is a link for our guests and members, who are not that familiar with the Buffalo Soldier era, in our national history. [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buffalo_Soldier"]

Sounds like he was full of buffalo chips...

[quote name='Commander Bob 92-93' date='Aug 4 2009, 08:39 PM' post='158508']
I believe the gentleman would have to be in his 80's, to have served in the any of the Buffalo Soldier units of WWII.

Here is a link for our guests and members, who are not that familiar with the Buffalo Soldier era, in our national history. [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buffalo_Soldier"]
[/url][url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buffalo_Soldier"]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buffalo_Soldier[/url]
[/quote]

Cdr Bob,
I am not sure that I understand your statement. Are you saying he claimed to be a buffalo soldier that served in ww2 or that he was assigned to a unit called buffalo soldiers later? Being 60 years old would be the right age for vietnam. You may or may not know that the 10th cav served in vietnam in the central highlands. The nickname for the 10th cav in VN and still is, is the buffalo soldiers for the current active duty 10th cav soldiers. In VN, blacks and whites were in the unit and we all got along great, we all depended on each other especilly when the bullets started flying. It was a honor for us to be called the buffalo soldiers of vietnam and we carried the tradition forward, at least D Trp. did. You can go to any vietnam 10th cav website and the buffalo soldier and elblems are widely refered to. If he was a buffalo soldier of the 10th cav vietnam era and there was a miscommunication between you and him, I can only imagine the heartbreak this guy must be feeling especially on top of how bad we were treated upon returning home and still treated bad in certain respects.

[quote name='Commander Bob 92-93' date='Aug 4 2009, 01:40 PM' post='158423']
Oh yeah??? What was your MOS?
[/quote]
31B20 for a little over a month and than 31B30 or Senior Field Radio Mechanic

However, I did not fix a radio till I was pulled in for 15 days to be assigned to the Texas Army National Guard. You know the professionals trying to stay out of Nam.

I had orders for Nam twice and both times they were changed at last minute.

In Germany I was made the Squadron Crypto Clerk which did not help me with panic at all.

[quote name='shamrock' date='Aug 4 2009, 10:14 PM' post='158523']
Cdr Bob,
I am not sure that I understand your statement. Are you saying he claimed to be a buffalo soldier that served in ww2 or that he was assigned to a unit called buffalo soldiers later? Being 60 years old would be the right age for vietnam. You may or may not know that the 10th cav served in vietnam in the central highlands. The nickname for the 10th cav in VN and still is, is the buffalo soldiers for the current active duty 10th cav soldiers. In VN, blacks and whites were in the unit and we all got along great, we all depended on each other especilly when the bullets started flying. It was a honor for us to be called the buffalo soldiers of vietnam and we carried the tradition forward, at least D Trp. did. You can go to any vietnam 10th cav website and the buffalo soldier and elblems are widely refered to. If he was a buffalo soldier of the 10th cav vietnam era and there was a miscommunication between you and him, I can only imagine the heartbreak this guy must be feeling especially on top of how bad we were treated upon returning home and still treated bad in certain respects.
[/quote]

Sorry Bob, I think my response should have been to Sharon. The way the replies are runing together I got mixed up.

[quote name='Commander Bob 92-93' date='Aug 3 2009, 07:58 PM' post='158312']
I don't do a lot of face to face with vets, these days. Years ago when the Vietnam vet wannabes and fakers, started to recount their days in the jungle. I would ask them one question: " So, what was your MOS?" A blank stare, or hesitation, usually gave them away.


I am also a bit disappointed how the word "HERO", is thrown around, these days. It devalues the word and the deeds. Just being incountry, does not make one a hero.
[/quote]


All my heros are dead.

America is a funny place or maybe it is the media. The firemen and cops who rushed into the Twin Towers on 911 are all heroes and the people in the building are victims.

It really bothers me that the Military has only awarded 6 Congressional Medals all posthumously since the 2 Wars started and when they have awarded some medals it was more for publicity than for merit.

Also from some reports it seems that VA has problems counting heros who were awarded Congressional Medal of Honor cause they are paying a lot more than actually. earned it according to some earlier posts by Allan.

My definition of a hero is someone who puts their life on the line to save or help people facing death.Someone who risks all to help. I never have and never will count victims as a hero all though they can be brave people such as the people who helped others get out of the towers who could have just saved their own ass.

Cpt Sully Sullenberger is a hero in my book also even though he does not strictly meet the criteria.He did stay calm and saved many lives including his own.

[quote name='shamrock' date='Aug 5 2009, 01:51 AM' post='158556']
Sorry Bob, I think my response should have been to Sharon. The way the replies are runing together I got mixed up.
[/quote]

He had on a fake Buffalo Soldier Uniform.

[quote name='sharon' date='Aug 5 2009, 10:40 AM' post='158630']
He had on a fake Buffalo Soldier Uniform.
[/quote]



What is a fake buffalo soldier uniform, what year was it suppose to show, what was the design? What kind of patches and rank were attached, what kind of head gear was he was wearing? You have got to be a lot more clear on how he was disrespecting the original bufffalo soldiers. What did he say to defend himself? Please me understand your claim.

[quote name='shamrock' date='Aug 5 2009, 12:51 AM' post='158556']
Sorry Bob, I think my response should have been to Sharon. The way the replies are runing together I got mixed up.
[/quote]


Yes, shamrock, I understand... I would have been honored to serve in the U.S.10th Cavalry.

As you posted, "... The nickname for the 10th cav in VN and still is, is the buffalo soldiers for the current active duty 10th cav soldiers...." . and you mention..."In VN, blacks and whites were in the unit...". I believe sharon was referring to the Buffalo Soldiers, from 1866 till 1951, when the U.S. armed services ended segregation. Big difference in time and uniform... A reminder of racism in the military.

Look at the nature of the War. Mostly bombs, that have killed our soilders. It not like any other war.
In RVN we fought with what we had on our back, during a fierce battle we fought, with air support, artillery, mortars, when it was raining we had to battle one on one, unit on unit in a jungle.
the War in Iraq, is from building to building. Theres not the opportunites to pick up a machine and charge the enemy out of anger, and fear. We receive contact, we call in the tanks, Choppers, Artillery and air support, when that decision is made, you dig deep, cover your head, and watch the enemy run or get blown up. With all being said, I am sure there is a lot of heroics in Iran, but unable to write the citation needed to make it a MOH winner

[quote name='shamrock' date='Aug 5 2009, 03:32 PM' post='158694']
What is a fake buffalo soldier uniform, what year was it suppose to show, what was the design? What kind of patches and rank were attached, what kind of head gear was he was wearing? You have got to be a lot more clear on how he was disrespecting the original bufffalo soldiers. What did he say to defend himself? Please me understand your claim.
[/quote]


He had on a black hat (smokie the bear looking) and a uniform that looked like a boyscout (only it was black) with some medal that look like they came from the Army Surplus Store. He had a crowd of young people telling them that he was a Buffalo Soldier. He did not even try and defend himself as he was stone cold busted. He got his sorry ass in his car and left.

The fighting in Iraq was kind of like fighting in Hue or Tet in Saigon. It is house to house with enemy running all over the place and shooting from roof tops and gutters. It is not heroic war, but bloody and confusing. I can see why these guys are nervous when they come back.

I was outside Hue during TET 68, we had enemy coming in every direction.
If I remember correct we were in one man position in a corridon for five straight day
24 Hours, the medic were giving us a little green pill to keep us awake